Anadivine from Kingston, NY have been gaining cult status over the years as one of the finest melodic prog-tinged emo punk bands of the early 00s. As someone who grew up friends with the band and who also helped shape the Hudson Valley alternative scene myself, I still objectively think some of Anadivine’s sophisticated melody-laced songs like “Capitol Arrangement”, “Dangerous Mixed With” or “Filling The Lungs (Of This Dead Machine)” remain some of the best rock to emerge from the region. “The Timid Gentleman” still proves Anadivine had some of the best hooks around. Twenty summers have passed since the band released their full-length effort Zoo, a time when Coheed & Cambria, Three, my old Nu/Post-hardcore band Divest, Anadivine, Shai Hulud, and more were all playing to growing crowds and gaining steam in the region.
Sean Paul Pillsworth (Vocals and Bass), Michael Saracino (Vocals and Guitar), Bill Manley (Guitar and Vocals), and Justin Meyer (Drums and Percussion) were the core lineup of the group at the time of Zoo. Meyer was never fully-satisfied with the mix on the album and so recently revisited the record in time for a 20th anniversary for fans. It was a pleasure to talk to Meyer and Pillsworth about the old days and this updated version.
Morgan for GCM: How do you feel listening back on Zoo after so many years? What was your headspace like going into it and knowing it could lead to bigger things? Thankfully our scene never had any band dramas whatsoever (sarcasm)…but for real, with time and growth and perspective how do you feel about the album and the impact it has had on fans around the world and within the path of your musical growth?
Justin- Very few things can remind you of something like hearing a song. The things I began to remember while hearing and working on these songs were insane but also cathartic because I was able to process them with my 41-year-old brain now. If I only knew then what I know now! But since we broke up shortly after Zoo came out we never got to promote it like we should have. As a result I just figured very few people ever listened to Zoo. It has been really nice to hear from people that still listen to Zoo and are excited to hear it in a new way.
Sean Paul- Listening to Zoo brings a flood of thoughts, some old, some new. I know leading up to tracking Zoo I felt a good amount of pressure, we were young and I was very keen to how hard bands from our area were breaking ground. I wanted to make sure we held a little piece of that. When I hear the songs now I feel more like a listener. For so long I just heard it as a piece of music that “could be better” I dig it. Lyrically I was trying to convey a good amount of frustration and pain outward, b.ut in a way that didn’t sound bitter or overtly sad. I knew that I wanted to write songs that I would be able to tether memories to.
GCM: In diplomatic terms, why did you feel a remix was needed? I feel like the tracks sound pushier and edgier now, a bit less commercial and more like the band was live. Way more attack to the drums and the guitars cut more, but vocals still high and catchy in mix. I love the smoother OG mix also and it fits the sort of direction of the times (many good memories of spinning it), but i think this kind of combo of catchy and the more rough and tumble side to some of the playing is enhanced a bit more on this Zoo (“Justin’s Version”). You’ve had awhile to live with the songs and think about the sounds without having to rush out and tour it lol.
J- Diplomatic or not I just never liked how Zoo turned out. There was just so much nonsense going on during the making of it which obviously affected the final product. Around late December 2023 I opened some of the sessions because I wanted something to work on while I was off from work. Next thing you know I was remixing the album. Originally I was just doing it for me. I wanted to see if I could make the album sound more like how I had heard it in my head all these years. The way Zoo originally turned out reminded me more of a Pixies album with raw darker tones and more room sounds used on the drums. That’s just not how I heard Zoo turning out. I grew up listening to Nirvana so in my head you start with Nevermind (I know Bleach was really first) and then comes In Utero. In the end I’m so happy with how the remixes turned out. I feel like I was finally able to settle some unfinished business.
SP: Music and our perception of how it should sound is always evolving, so when the idea came to remix ZooI was all for it. There’s definitely more room in this version, there’s a depth that was perhaps lost by how we preferred to shine the mixes in 2004. That’s all really up to the listeners who have connected with this album prior, I’m more interested to hear what they think.
GCM: Zoo was such a great album name and I couldn’t believe no one had thought of it before for a punk/emo record. It really sums up life in the music scene or in general. Can you refresh how you came up with it?
SP- The idea for naming the album Zoo came from a painting I saw that was done in a crude childish water paint style depicting four sections each one containing an animal and at the bottom it just said Zoo. I just dug the word Zoo and how you could bend the concept of zoos to other parts of human nature.
J- We were all just bouncing names off each other. I don’t remember who exactly said Zoo but I remember after it was said Bill Manley suggested “Animal Kingdom.” I thought that would have been an absolutely hilarious name for an album but we went with Zoo. I really thought it was the perfect name for the album. Ultimately, we wanted a name that reflected the variety of songs we were writing for it.
GCM: I think the album really in hindsight succeeded in ways not many other bands did as well…except like Thursday ‘War All The Time’ comes to mind…of balancing musicianship with catchy and progressive elements while keeping the songs concise and a lot of dynamics. The “Alcohol And Oxygen” intro still gives me chills and is so wide open and big and early 00s pop screamo perfection dramatic sounding and then you have something more playful like ‘Love Trust And Fake Integrity” or the opening track’s intensity setting the stage. What were the biggest challenges attempting something so multi faceted?
J- That’s just how we naturally wrote together. We were all open to trying new ideas or approaches in songs. Sometimes we’d try things that we’d have to practice independently first before being able to play them collectively as a group. We’d just get together at my parents’ house Monday-Thursday every week for months and just write. We were aware of certain elements we wanted Zoo to have, for example a big dramatic closing track (“Duet From the Dead”) or something energetic to start the album off with (“Adding Insult to Industry”). After that, writing the album just felt like putting the pieces of a puzzle together with a bunch of friends.
SP: I don’t think we were out to write a bunch of diverse songs that might alienate one another but sometimes I think it sounds that way. When we wrote these songs we were working with a new lineup dynamic and we really found ourselves creating music that was just spontaneous. Everything was new in a way, and at the same time we already carried some weight from our prior release. I can say when it was time to make the record my attitude was, you get what you get. I knew people that just knew us from the EP might find something different about this release. I hear the growing pains on this record. It reminds me of how absorbent we were and how unafraid we were to try things. That really only came with youth, a lot of this was uncharted waters for us, but I think we preferred it that way.
GCM: How do you feel listening to your approach to drumming at that time, Justin? You were always known for insane speed but this album I think also showcased your nuance and precision really well. What are your feelings listening back? Also, what do you guys think was special about the Upstate NY Woodstock/Kingston music scene at that time? It is hard to describe the magic and chaos of that era to people who weren’t there. I think we were all just really living in our art and also growing pains and all the good and bad that comes with it.
J- Insane speed! Thank you! I’m very proud of the drums on Zoo. The drums were recorded straight to analog tape so what you hear is actually me. I absolutely hate drums on modern recordings because everything is fixed to the point where you can’t differentiate one drummer to the next. I’ve always wanted to make sure that what you heard me play on a recording you saw me perform live. The Hudson Valley music scene has always been filled with such fantastic musicians. Having that level of musicianship always around you made you want to be better at your craft. I’m a very competitive person so it would drive me to practice for hours. I also had the BEST drum teacher a person could have asked for: Victor Ruzzo. The foundation he gave me on the drums allowed me to be able to hold my own in our scene.
SP- The air in our area was electric in the early 2000s, from Poughkeepsie to Albany, upstate NY was starting to pump out bands that were punching way above their weight class. We all grew up hearing that you had to go to the city to be seen or get signed. In a way it felt like the playing field got leveled a little.
Stream the new version of Zoo here:
https://anadivine.bandcamp.com/album/zoo-2024
MORGAN Y. EVANS
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